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Wednesday, 13 October 2021

Highlights September 2021 - the big fix

Church in Wales Governing Body September 2021                                                                                                                                                   Source: YouTube

Highlights of the Church in Wales (CinW) meeting of the Governing Body, September 2021, have been published. 

Highlights for bishops of the CinW they may be but for the vast majority of Anglicans, they will be anything but that. Attracting widespread criticism, the process has been a gigantic fix.

Built around a Bill to authorise a service of blessing for same-sex partnerships, the meeting's opening prayers invited us to show "love, compassion and concern for all those who are anxious about the day's debate, especially for the members of the LGBTI+ community." Especially for the LGBTI+ community! Do others merit no concern?

Even the response 'In your love and tenderness, remake us' was geared towards voting in favour of the measure. The cleric leading the prayers was far from neutral having already been remade, 'living happily' in a civil partnership with a younger man, he is a noted LGBT activist in common with all three women bishops.

One of the more illuminating speeches came from the Revd Dr Jonathon Wright (S&B), who submitted an amendment that, according to the Chair, Judge Andrew Keyser QC, 'touched on a fundamental part of the Bill'. Dr Wright wanted to have it delayed until it could be considered holistically as part of the Church’s doctrine on marriage, and introduced with same-sex marriage at some future date.

The bishops were in no mood to stop and reflect on their actions, typified by the response the bishop of Monmouth, Cherry Vann, also in a same sex civil partnership, said that it would be "a huge missional and pastoral opportunity lost for yet another generation. . . The cry will go up, ‘How long, O Lord, how long?'"

Not the Lord, bishop Vann but GB members. The amendment was lost by 77 votes to 27, with no abstentions. 

The Bill itself was proposed by the bishop of St Asaph who was "conscious that some members saw the Bill as a departure from Biblical teaching and the historic faith of the Church", probably his most accurate statement, but nevertheless he asked if members would be “bold enough to take a decision in favour of faithful love and mercy, which will bring hope and joy?”

The bishops won, the Bill passed. The Church in Wales lost.


  1. If that drivel is the "highlights" how dreadful the rest of it must have been.

  2. Do those fools really believe that the rest of the world gives a fig what they post on the Internet?

  3. So,the Bishops of the Church in Wales have steadfastly endorsed througfh their Leadership the Joining of two People of the Same Sex in total disregard of The Holy Scripture, that is The Bible, which, each Candidate for Ordination takes in their hand and VOWS to follow it's Teaching. As I understand Consecration of a Bishop, again, each Candidate, who gone through Sacred Synod, again Promises to uphold the teachings of The Bible. Having stated the above, I look forward to my more greatly educated members of this group to now correct me. From my own posting, it is my belief that Cherry Vann should resign from the See of Monmouth.

    1. Every one of them should resign.
      However there isn't a shred of decency among them so don't hold your breath QP.

    2. I dare say you are right, and therefore I will take your advice and not hold my breathe

  4. Rushed through as it says. What isn’t widely known is that a celebration dinner was booked before a vote ever took place. Some raised eyebrows when Bishop Vann presented the bill afterwards, including the cost of a “karaoke and smoke machine package.” Controlling to the last, she had also pre ordered dinner which had to included a “non coarse pate” and roast lamb “well done.” One of the waitresses commented that the assembled company were rude b******!

    1. Quelle surprise!14 October 2021 at 15:20

      So the desired result was not merely predicted but obviously preordained and fixed.
      Well I never!

  5. Guys the result wasn't fixed which is even sadder when you think about it. It was actually as close as could be in the House of Clergy.


    1. Thank you WHAMAB. I did not wish to imply that the vote was rigged. Rather that the whole process has been driven by the bench using the Governing Body to suggest motivation was bottom up rather than top down. See Lowlights September 2015.

    2. Of course it was rigged and it has been rigged for decades.
      As soon as the very first vote on the ordination of women to the Priesthood failed, the rigging started the next day. If memory serves, under the then rules, the motion could not be brought back for another vote for 5 years, needless to say that was altered.
      The next part of the plan was to start interfering was those invited to stand for and sit on the Governing Body. Any "traditionalists" who retired or died were replaced with pro-women voters until enough votes were "in the bank". Then the same process continued over the women Bishops issue and then on to the queering agenda.
      The antics of Darth --Insidious and his coven were as patently obvious then as they are now.
      The abuse to which +Roy was subjected after the failed vote speaks for itself.
      As do all the machinations of Peggy the Pilate and Jenny Wigley subsequently (and as repeatedly reported on here by AB).

    3. The last two names have now all gone, having secured their way.

    4. With big fat Church in Wales pensions to lubricate their passage, neither of whom was ever worthy or up to the role of Priest, never mind Canonesse.
      Paid for by the few remaining pew sitters.

    5. Quelle surprise!16 October 2021 at 07:59

      Following Gabriel's comments above, this news item should come as no surprise to anyone.
      A text book example of underhand methods in use at the Welsh Assembly.

    6. It wasn't rigged. I was there. This is what those representing the CiW wanted sadly. Those proffering baseless conspiracies tell me: do you really think they've allowed the house of clergy to be so close? Also, they didn't need to fix the other houses. All I can say for those still in CiW is vote orthodox laity and clergy onto GB and things will change. Those who walked away, what did you expect after all?


    7. PP. Unfortunately, Stonewall is no longer the charity of the Gay man in promoting human rights and the injustice of the laws held against them. The Lesbian and Trans folk who did not suffer the full weight of laws (ex clause 28) joined many Gay male groups and unfortunately seize the agenda of which the current direction is a sad example. The Gay Christian Movement and Pride Movement equally fell to this toxic brand of activism.
      Sadly these inform the agenda in politics and in the Church, which instead of promoting it's truth it's has gone off towards staying "cool" in the margins of secular society.
      The recent decision in the Church and the greater acceptance of LGBT etc, is perhaps "leveling up", being societally "woke" is unfortunately a toxic bi-product.
      The term "Gay" was a masculine term for a homosexual and lesbian it's female equivalent. Now, the term is used by both. Where we often see women identify as a "Gay Lesbian". Does the man have another label? The sexuality debate these days is much more a female agenda, a battlefield for smashing anything that does not measure up. Ordination being a prime example Hence, the Church where once a gay clergyman man was silently acknowledged by their heterosexual peers and diocesan, as long as the person was discreet not much occured, were some fell many silently held to strong devotion, held in esteem in their parishes and some rising to purple with greater fatherly devotion holding the theological and traditional tenets that were the foundation.

      All can cite such churchman and know the passion and devotion to their faith. Where are they today? They are marginalised by this toxic brand of activism and the Church has jumped on this band wagon on a road paved with potholes, many of which have already damaged the wheels

    8. Quelle surprise!16 October 2021 at 21:24

      I have no idea whether in truth you were there or not Whamab, however has it not occurred to you that allowing one of the three houses to appear to be "so close" was part of the plan?
      Close or not, please explain the celebration dinner booked in advance, but also please explain why a Bishopesse claiming to be a Christian leader would be willing to engage in such a tasteless way of publicly demonstrating schadenfreude at the cost of those hurt so much by the outcome of the rigged vote.

  6. Once again they push the self destruct button..

  7. The tree eater is up to his usual trick of jumping on the political band wagon again.
    DodoJo's experience has taught him naught it seems.
    HM Stanley: Denbigh votes on statue of Victorian adventurer
    Amid widespread protests from the Black Lives Matter movement following the death of George Floyd in the USA, petitions were drawn up calling for the removal of a statue of Stanley in Denbigh and an obelisk honouring him in nearby St Asaph.
    It was supported by the Bishop of St Asaph, Gregory Cameron, who said Stanley had "little respect for the natives of Africa".

    1. Hurrah L e V - Stanley has been saved by an overwhelming majority. Bishop of St Asaph on the wrong side again.
      Cymraes yn Lloegr

  8. Typical hypercritical, thoughtless comment from the Bishop of St Asaph. When has he ever shown any respect for traditional Anglicans in Wales? Anglican Misfit

  9. Sadly, there's no room for 'Anglican Misfits' in the contemporary Church in Wales.

    Or, indeed, in any of the Anglican provinces of the British Isles. Isn't it best, therefore, to acknowledge that fact, ans simply cop out? I see no prospect whatever of that current situation changing.

  10. We already have feminists like Serene Jones proclaiming victory and I quote "women will come to dominate religious leadership and that this will powerfully reshape Americans’ understanding of God from stern father to more of a maternal healer and nurturer.“ As women now outnumber men in seminary schools by a large margin and with feminism gaining ground in our wider culture with each passing day, the feminization of liberal Protestant denominations will be swift, complete and irreversible. The last bastion of Christianity are Catholic and Orthodox Churches.

  11. PP. Female ministry a document written in the 19 century by Catherine Booth, was a document that enlightened in saying that women have a right to preach and teach. Moreover,with the respect for those they lead, doing this things women do best, the coming alongside, enhancing and encouraging those in the margins. It makes one mindful of the role of the Deaconess, many will have experienced this ministry.
    Today, unfortunately the way some women have conducted the fierce right to Holy Orders, very caustic in some, has given the cause much less than more in His service. But, there have been those who have like the gentleness of the role of Deaconess, brought much to Holy Orders. Unfortunately, agreement as to the right to "being" admitted into Holy Orders is in itself a matter for debate in which opinion is divided. And will continue to be so

    What has tarnish the ministry of women,is not the debate itself, but a matter of conduct.
    It has been seen in some caustic chaos in some dioceses, in others less so and in a smaller few, acceptance, because the Discipline of "being" ordained is a personal acceptance and acted out with due humility. But, there are those who thrive on another level, which we have all see, experienced and felt, were the agenda is one of feminism, divide and conquer. However, the exception is negligible, but it is those quiet souls who frequently are silenced by the majority.

    The work Catherine Booth published, was extremely controversial, but, it was afforded respect widely because of her personal actions. Preaching to hundreds more than one service, with gifted and leading Churchman respecting and befriending. Do we see this conduct today? Infrequently probably! But, the unbecoming conduct recently in Wales, leaves a dry and parched landscape. So much has unknotted the ties that bind us as the Body of Christ, how we remedy this remains a seriously debated argument, were secularism is becoming a seed sow, as tares in a once ripe field of golden corn. I am mindful of the letter to the Churches in Asia Minor (Rev) are we listening to the Holy Spirit!

  12. Same sex blesings. How does the Bench and those of us procliaim to be Members of the Church (in Wales) support this "Bill"? Oh the Bench has a member who is engaged in a relationship totally against the teachngs of the Bible. The question surely, must be, how can a Woman, in a Lesbian relationship, not only be Ordained but also be Consecrated a "Bishop" please note inverted Commas.

    1. She's not the first gay bishop to be Bishop of Monmouth is she? Not by a long stretch. The irony.


  13. PP. From one on the ground in Mon, I find that Na' Lady, is well respected and received by her Diocese. Even her two but one, predecessors are supportive. So far, her management has proved a safe pair of hands - after the dreadful previous.