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| The 73rd Bishop of Llandaff, Mary Stallard Source: Church in Wales |
The 73rd bishop of Llandaff is to be the feminist campaigner Mary Stallard, currently assistant bishop in Bangor. Someone already committed to the secular strategy of the bench.
A popular choice judging by the reception of the assembled mini-crowd made up of those who, presumably, are prepared to go along to get on.
Some of the comments already received under other threads have been less than enthusiastic to say the least.
Bishop Stallard was appointed by Andy John after his elevation to archbishop to run his diocese while he was busy running the Province. This despite the Church in Wales Review recommendation to cut the number of dioceses.
By implication the archbishop will now be considering who to appoint as his new Asst bishop.
Unless nobody else could be persuaded to take on the job one can only speculate on the quality of the other candidates.
Presumably men are no longer eligible in the Church in Wales.
Postscript [24.01.2023]
ELECTORAL COLLEGE: BEHIND THE SCENES By Rev'd Zoe King, Electoral College member and Ministry Area Leader in Barry.
For a list of Llandaff College members click HERE.
First appointment will be Rev. Andrew Sully, Bishop’s Chaplain
ReplyDeleteIf that's the best available for Llandaff today then it is truly the end of times.
ReplyDeleteGood news for Llandaff. good news for all people of good will. Good news too for AB as rantings about Mary will no doubt fuel this dreadful blog for some years to come. It starts with this post.
ReplyDeleteThank God it wasn't some misogynistic erstwhile flying bishop from England or some evangelical suffragan wedded to covert conversion therapies. We're safe from that nonsense for a few years to come. A warm welcome, Mary and we look forward to the lovely Andrew coming too.
Croeso
Brown nosing alive and well in Llandaff.
Delete…..and Andrew coming too, who is Andrew to which you refer?
DeleteWho is the Andrew to whom you refer.
DeleteAndrew is Rev Andrew Scully, Mary’s husband
DeleteMy source among the electors - someone not from the vacant diocese - tells me that Mary Stallard proved to be overwhelmingly the preferred candidate of the electors, and that was in no small part a result of the degree of support which she received from the electors of the diocese of Llandaff.
ReplyDeleteBut what was the competition, to whom was she preferred?
DeleteBewildered
You tempt me on to delicate ground, because I'm disinclined to put into a public arena information which my source, someone whose good opinion I value, might conceive as a betrayal of confidence. We've been close for many years, and while we disagree profoundly on the current state of Anglicanism, we nonetheless respect one another's different view.
DeleteSo I'll go no further than to say that - for instance - while one aspirant was a priest who'd served their entire ministry in the Llandaff diocese and another was a scholarly priest from another Welsh diocese, when the votes came to be tallied up Mary Stallard's support was ahead of that which the other aspirants garnered.
And once the electors from Llandaff diocese, having debated together, made their preference for Ms Stallard very clear, the electoral college appears to have gone with that preference.
And, on this occasion at least, no 'clergyperson' not currently serving in the province of Wales was a contender.
And even this much of a disclosure might land me in trouble!
You’ve said enough for us to deduce who you are talking about. Shame on your friend for breaking the confidence of the college and shame on you for sharing it.
DeleteDD.
It should get you trouble since I know exactly who one of the people is now by your description. However that being said, a confidence breaker can't expect confidences kept in return.
DeleteWHAMAB
Since I'm not accountable to either of you, but only to my friend and to my own conscience, the opinion of both of you isn't of any real significance to me. The Welsh province is for sure a small entity, but nothing which I've said can enable you to be wholly sure as to any specific individual. Of course you're free to hazard guesses, but you can get no further than that. You're welcome to speculate as you feel inclined, but speculation is all that you'll achieve.
DeleteYour contact has no business being a member of the Electoral College if they can't keep their gob shut!
DeleteOn that basis alone they can have no complaint about you not keeping a confidence they could not.
I've no idea whatever as to the names or, indeed, the current ministerial roles, of any of the other candidates other, of course, than the one who was ultimately elected.
DeleteSo what I don't know I can hardly convey to anyone of this thread, or to anyone else! The sole question which I did venture to ask - in the light of controversy about previous similar appointments - was whether any of the candidates were from outside the province and with no previous associations with the Church in Wales.
If WHAMAB and DD reckon that they're able to identify individuals in the light of what I posted, I'd gently suggest that they must be doing so on the basis of information which has come their way by other means rather than by anything which I've said, because they apparently know more than I do.
Clearly John, since the C-i-W is a 'small entity' as you say, there is information I have gleaned over the years that make your description - i.e. 'a scholarly priest in another diocese' shout out to me a particular name I will not mention.
DeleteIt's a moot point now anyway, since he did not get elected.
WHAMAB
Thank you, Mr Ellis. Your source and the information you received is entirely consistent with what I have been told by (again) another reliable source.
DeleteClearly, the Llandaff electors did their homework and were of a common mind. This was, largely, to block any possibility of the Archbishop being translated. If you look carefully at who the electors are, then their preferred cadidate and the outcome of the election should not come as a surprise. We can only hope that when the See of St Davids falls vacant there is similar unanimity in order to prevent a disastrous translation. Bangor is what he wanted in 2009 and Bangor is where he deserves to stay, if only to live with the consequences of his disastrous episcopate there. Bangor, sadly, deserves so much better.
As for Mary Stallard, my sources in St Asaph refer to a catalogue of complaints about bullying prior to 2011. The fact that she side-stepped a residentiary canonry to become a school chaplain is perhaps an indication that she needed to be sidelined from the centre of diocesan polity. After five years of June Osborne, people in Llandaff should keep a watching brief.
And Mr Sully... he was described to me recently as the 'Charge of the Lightweight Brigade.' He has a lot to say, apparently, but there is very little substance to it.
@ WHAMAB:
DeleteAn aside possibly not really relevant to the main flow of this thread, but on reflection it strikes me that in one way the Welsh province may have changed more significantly than I'd realized over the almost forty years since I was an Anglican in Wales.
In that back in the '70s it seemed to me that every diocese in Wales had at least one or two 'scholarly' priests. Not of the stellar, Rowan Williams, variety who end up in academic roles; just thoughtful incumbents with a particular bent who combined their pastorates with the application of their learning and their particular field of interest in the service of knowledge and of the church. From Canon E. T. Davies down in Monmouth diocese exploring the sociology of religion in the industrial areas of Wales to Chancellor W.D. Parry up in Bangor diocese exploring the rather rarified study of the liturgy - but who was thus able in the '60s to guide the standing liturgical commission of the Church in Wales into the production of revised services which secured almost universal acceptance despite the laity's affection for the 300-year old BCP - 'scholarly' priests were ... well, just there - part of the 'furniture' of every diocese.
So are 'scholarly' priests really now such 'rare birds' in Welsh parishes that I can allude to one, without even identifying the diocese, let alone the individual's name, and thus render him (or her) immediately identifiable? If so, it's a great pity.
@ Athelstan Riley:
DeleteI'm so far out of the Anglican loop now that I don't know who the overwhelming majority of the electors are, and if I did their names wouldn't convey anything.
But from the rather little that I've gleaned from my sole source, the proceedings of the electoral college appear to have been carefully and very fairly followed, and - a rather surprising thing for me, having, way back, studied the history, over the centuries, of such ecclesiastical gatherings - the atmosphere appears to have been entirely charitable.
You can be certain of one thing.
DeleteThe Electoral College members of the Bangor Diocese were over the moon to be dumping typhoid Mary onto Llandaff as it will be one less nasty bit of work malingering around in the North.
So Llandaff gets the poison dwarf and Bangor keeps the chocolate teapot Randy Pandy and his sub-Dean.
ReplyDeleteCan't decide for which Diocese I feel sorrier.
Very interesting situation regarding the new Bishop of Llandaff “elect”. Many years ago I was told when both Mary and Andrew were Ordained and Married that Mary would not take her husband’s surname out of respect of her Father, another Bishop, and wanted to keep the lineage alive. Well done at the cost of the Church in Wales you have succeeded.
ReplyDelete"out of respect of her Father, another Bishop" [citation needed]!
DeleteWho's Who says "d of late Rev. J. C. Stallard" https://doi.org/10.1093/ww/9780199540884.013.U296836
- Checker
No matter your opinion on the outcome of the election the speed of the appointment is impressive. In England these things often take months and months to be decided and announced.
ReplyDeleteSeedy rather than speedy.
DeleteRandy Pandy has been setting this up for a year or more since he made her his assistant in Bangor, to general astonishment.
It was both predictable and predicted.
The Champing chump (or should that be the Chumping Champ?) will be just as bad, if not worse, than Caiaphas.
Then there's the question of motive.
DeleteOne possibility is that Randy Pandy doesn't trust or agree with Juno's appointment of Dick the Dean, his boyfriend and Teilo the dog to Llandaff the week before she shipped out.
Perhaps Mary's real job is to keep a close eye on him and a lid on the can of worms following him down the M4 from Oxford?
Baseless as usual Ruth - what 'can of worms' have you suddenly unearthed or should I say fabricated? Groundless defamation as usual.
DeleteDD
As usual, you fail to determine the difference between questions and defamation.
DeleteYou really are a complete idiot.
The Deluded Dunce is busy spinning BS as usual.
DeleteTroll.
The can of worms in which Dick the Dean immersed himself in Christchurch Oxford is neither "fabricated" nor "unearthed" but is rather a matter of record in The Church Times and elsewhere.
DeleteDD is a worthless contributor to this blog.
The cult in Wales would be better off without her too.
I know I am not liked here because I draw attention to your nastiness and your out-of-touchness. I, on the other hand, am nothing but kindness itself. I shall ask Dick the Dean to pray for you all at the Teilo shrine.
DeleteDD
You're disliked because you're a c*ckw*mble and you spout a load of b*ll*cks.
Delete"Groundless defamation as usual" you say?
Dick the Dean is clearly in very hot water in Christchurch over the defamation suit and Clergy Disciplinary Measure proceedings concerning his alleged slander and/or libel of Martyn Percy, not to mention the investigations of the Charity Commissioners into the losses of £millions blown on bloated fees for lawyers and PR consultants.
It is conceivable that Dick the Dean might well soon be known as Dick the bankrupt.
Who is footing the bill for Justin Gau KC? I doubt he's doing it all for Dick pro bono!
Good heavens boys and girls, what's all this trivial bickering about who said what to who amid allegations of confidential treachery! Surely the whole matter ought to have been 'open and transparent' as the C-in-W purports to be. Why the 'Masonic' mystery about selection of a bishop? Even in selecting/electing a Prime Minister, all guts are spilled in public airing.
ReplyDeleteAs for +Mary I have only heard her preach once (as I no longer attend C-in-W worship) and that was Remembrance Sunday last year at Bangor Cathedral. A deplorable sermon based on three characters from WWI which was totally irrelevant to the pew-ranks of uniformed youngsters and even older Royal British Legion 'veterans' none of them even old enough to have served in WWII. Even the British Legions has been at pains to modernise itself and Remembrance Sunday from the Great War. Assistant Bishop was without doubt: off-message.
Better, however, than previous Bangor Cathedral Remembrance Sunday service where prayers were asked for all 'fallen' of post war actions including, to everyone's head-scratching East Temor! Ugh? No British troops killed in that uprising not even covert SAS types. When challenged later, then Dean Kathy Jones admitted that she'd Google searched for a suitable sermon and Intercessions text for 11/11/11 and .... oops ... cribbed one from a former Chaplain of the Australian Army who, yes, had served in East Temor with losses. It explained too how British losses in other 'theatres' were missed out. The Australians never having served in, say, Sierra Leone or Bosnia. How very shoddy of both ++Andrew's appointments to 'senior ranks'.
Does it matter? Yes it does. It simply demonstrates that as well as having little knowledge of theology, his choices also lack simple awareness of the basics.
Old Bill
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64342940
ReplyDeleteWelby won't say prayers for gay couples.
Preserving the Communion is still the priority for Justin.
@ Ruth
ReplyDeleteFair point Ruth and plausible. But why then did he (personally) appoint the failed applicant for ordination, Msgr. Sion ap Rhys to titular dean of Bangor. Same rather iffy persona, same baggage of (unpopular) clergy complaints against him when he was full time Diocesan Secretary, same lust for recognition and 'esteem', same leanings and 'blessings' to the LGBTQ+. Apparently he even has a 'pooch' which is hand carried into Eucharist services from time to time. Nah. I can't agree your theory. It seems that ++Andrew is hell-bent on odd-ball appointments; perhaps because he has slowly realised that he shouldn't have been appointed either.
More likely that ++Andrew runs with those candidates who will never excel him in the intelligence stakes and thus show him up as a failure. That maybe explains why such a low bar has been set.
Have you never heard of a deception plan to conceal the real assault?
DeleteBasic training at the Royal Military Academy, Sandhurst as well as British Army and NATO Doctrine included in my Tactical Aide Memoire.
Trojan Horse and all that.
And don't forget that Randy Pandy owes his allegiance to Byzantine Barry Morgan for his patronage.
As Clerum, you're on the right track with "lust".
DeleteI hear it was something to do with the interregnum between wife one and wife two, allegedly.
Why do the anglican lady "bishops" always dress up as catholic bishops? Are there no protestants among them?
ReplyDeleteThey're not Bishops.
DeleteThey are parodies and I posters, false prophets all.
Imposters
DeleteSo why do they wish to appear as catholic rather than protestant "imposters?"
DeleteBecause the Catholic church is next on their target list?
Deletehttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-64344935
ReplyDeleteBeware of lone Policemen (and Priests).
@ Laughing Gas
ReplyDeleteAh indeed! I think we might have bantered before on umpteen values of RMAS (or my case the old Mons Officer college pre merging with Sandhurst in the early 1970's).
With apologies to those AB correspondents who have no appreciation of the ethos, excellence and training at Sandhurst or Mons you will, Laughing Gas, remember the Sandhurst motto "Serve to Lead" with the corollary of "Lead to Serve". Sadly, the Church-in-Wales recognises neither. They neither serve nor lead nor would most of them even pass through Pre-RCB and the strict 'aptitude' tests even at Stage I of entry.
Yes of course I know of the umpteen variants on theme of Trojan Horse, but on theme of mottos, I always liked that of the army's Intelligence Corps: 'Manui dat cognitio vires' and those of us employing it are better prepared, I think, for the shambles to follow and the downfalls of those who have caused it.
As for me, that other motto of a certain no-nonsense Regiment close to my heart also rings true in wondering what white rabbits ++Andrew might pull out of his Alice in Wonderland hat/mitre: 'Utrinque Paratus...!' - Ready for Anything.
Laughing Gas tempts me to suppose that you were once member of the Royal Army Dental Corps. I'm sure not. Give me a clue ... !!!
Old Bill (Ret'd)!
In my day "Army intelligence" was a contradiction in terms.
DeleteBut I was never into pulling teeth either. 😂
@ DD 21-01-23 1634 Hrs
ReplyDeletePlease, please 'DD' exclude me from your petitions to pray for me or to ask that other DD - Dick the Dean - to meddle in my own otherwise good rapport with God. Kind of you to suggest it, but I'd rather not risk all by your interferences. Perhaps you should ask others for their permission too before you intrude ?
Ad Clerum
I was most amused at Anglican Unscripted's (Episode 783) coverage of the election of +Mary to Llandaff and the latest shenanigans of the CiW. A damning indictment from George Conger - "a problem church", "ruin and irrelevance" indeed! Let's hope the bishops and bishopettes are listening.
ReplyDeleteJaded Pewsitter
You can rest assured they are NOT listening but are hellbent on following their own queering agenda, regardless of the cost and hurt to others or the imminent demise of the Church in Wales.
Deletehttps://youtu.be/EXmRGhIMcyE
DeleteHere's the link to edition 783 of Anglican Unscripted.
For the "latest, greatest, cookyest" church in Wales comments, start listening at 28' and 20".
The chocolate teapot and the poison dwarf win international coverage and well deserved ridicule.
The Bishopettes are at the root of the problems.
Delete"Intersectionalist feminist" could well be Offa's trench
Bully boy byzantine Barry, Barry, Barry, Barry Morgan.
DeleteThe spider at the centre of his Web 🕸
Never a truer word spoken.
First of all, feminism is about equality and benefits all genders. Moreover, having a female majority sit on the Bench of Bishops, or even an all-female one, albeit temporarily, in order to speed up the de-construction process of patriarchal structures and toxic masculinity norms prevailing within the Church of Wales - would be of enormous benefit for all involved. We also have to understand that our society in changing, today, over 30% of women in heterosexual marriages (UK) out-earn their male partners - and as women have overtaken men in higher education and are now making up 65% of all university graduates (again, UK) - it's only a matter of time before female breadwinners become the norm. And I'm not saying that women are smarter or better than men, far from it - simply put, skills historically associated with women such as communication, collaboration, creativity and competence are in much greater demand (vs physical strength & bravado) in today's knowledge-based economy. Men, on the other hand, most, not all, continue to cling on to traditional masculinity ideology (violence, racism, transphobia, homophobia, risk taking, social dominance, emotional repression, etc.) and that is exactly what is holding them back in this ever-progressing world of ours. I know this might sound radical to many but doing away with masculinity and gender altogether is the best path forward for men and embracing feminism is the solution to the challenging problems facing them. In the end, flipping such a centuries-old patriarchal institution as the Church of Wales towards a more feminist one does bring us a major symbolic victory.
ReplyDeleteIntersectional Feminist.
Your ideas are lovely in a secular world, but the Church is not called to be secular. Anyone who chooses to follow Christ must "deny themselves" - not just a bit of themselves, but the whole of themselves. They must take up their crosses and follow. The late John Henry Rowlands, former warden of St Michael's College in Llandaff would have loved to have been a bishop. He was never elected to such a post, but continued humbly to follow his Lord. He didn't bark on about women's ordination preventing him from 'getting the purple'.
DeleteLike many on the plank today, you seem to think that the Church must play society's games. This is why the Church is failing miserably. I know plenty of people who once were faithful members of their local congregations who no longer darken the doorstep. They have become demoralized by the games the feminists, gay, lesbian, and transgender communities play. These groups no longer think in terms of denying themselves, taking up their crosses and following. They want everything on their terms, and they want it now.
If your scenario of feminist deconstruction of patriarchy came to pass, the Cult in Wales would die instantaneously. Since 1997, when women were first ordained to the priesthood here in Wales, the death of the Cult has speeded up. I know women who did not want another female bishop in Llandaff, and now intend to leave their local congregations in protest. People should be very careful what they wish for.
Seymour
The feminism you describe is a destructive myth peddled to the gullible. You don't want equality but advantage.
DeleteIf there is such thing as toxic masculinity it is more than balanced by toxic feminism.
For intersectionalist feminist I read militant lesbian anarchist anti-Christ.
"feminism...... benefits all genders"?
DeleteThere are only two genders and feminist dogma has created huge problems for both.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-64364143
ReplyDeleteThe feminist rot has now reached the Holy Land itself via the Lutherans.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-64364664
ReplyDeleteA good juicy Covid lockdown Catholic drinking story. 😂
That's not all, LG.
ReplyDeleteDid you see the lovely articles on page 9 of Friday's Western Mail?
Martin Shipton has been busy digging into the goings on in Christchurch and the alleged misconduct of Dick the Dean during his short time there as sub Dean, with very expensive lawyers issuing threats.
If she knows about the pile of manure in her "In Tray" awaiting her arrival in Llys Esgobette, the poison dwarf Mary would be wise to reconsider her position before it is too late to back out.
Randy Pandy is busy playing the cover-up game again too but he knew better than to translate to Llandaff.
Heigh ho!
Here's a link to the first of Friday's articles in the Western Mail.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.pressreader.com/uk/western-mail/20230120/281698323865916
https://www.thinkinganglicans.org.uk/christ-church-oxford-seeks-to-remove-dean-on-medical-grounds/
DeleteThis article includes details of the allegations made against Dick the Dean.
If Dick is the type to allegedly refer to his colleague and boss as a "manipulative turd" and "little Hitler" then he should fit in well in the Cult in Wales.
As was identified in the report of the Richard Pain affair in Monmouth, bullying and foul language is a pre-requisite for appointment to senior clergy posts.
Sales of back issues of Private Eye 1562 are predicted to improve over the next couple of weeks.
Dick the Dean's barking Rottweiler from Pimp Chambers has got the chocolate teapot Randy Pandy cacking himself already!
Delete🤣
Dick the Dean is making his "mark" much to the disgust of many of the few remaining pew sitters.
DeleteInstead of reinstating the 12:15 Eucharist after the Covid restrictions, the Lady Chapel is now the venue for a post 11am Eucharist glass of Sherry.
Has Dick tapped into the Capon's illicit "entertainment" budget?
Well, if there was any remaining doubt over Caiaphas' motive for appointing Dick the Dean in such unseemly haste prior to her hasty departure, it's obvious now that it was her final "gesture" to the Cathedral and Diocese of Llandaff as well as the RB and the Church in Wales generally.🖕🖕🖕
DeleteThere are several outstanding questions about Dick the Dean's dodgy dealings and appointment to the Llandaff Deanery.
DeleteWho provided Dick the Dean with references?
Were the references taken up, either by the Chapter of Llandaff Cathedral, Caiaphas, the Diocesan office or the incompetent HR department in the RB?
Did the references stand up to scrutiny?
Did the HR department of the RB carry out all proper due diligence?
After the concerns expressed on AB's blog and published before Dick's installation at the end of November, how is it possible for the chocolate teapot Randy Pandy to infer in the Western Mail that the Welsh bishops were unaware of any issues or concerns over the appointment?
Does anyone believe a single word that proceedeth from the mouth of Randy Pandy?
Did no-one on the Chapter or PCC of Llandaff Cathedral raise any concerns or object to the appointment?
Has yet another PR disaster landed on the Cathedral, right under the nose of Gerard Elias KC?
Why doesn't Gerard Elias KC tell Justin Gau KC to p*ss off and keep his nose out of Llandaff Cathedral business?
Why would anyone think threats made from Pimp Chambers in London concerning possible "contempt" proceedings over a clergy disciplinary tribunal in the established Church of England carry any weight in the disestablshed Church in Wales concerning the possible fraudulent appointment of Dick the Dean?
What are Gerard Elias KC and the Chapter of Llandaff Cathedral going to do now, or following a "guilty" finding against Dick the Dean in the Oxford Diocesan Clergy disciplinary tribunal currently underway?
Given the severity of the allegations against Dick the Dean, why hasn't he been suspended pending the outcome of the tribunal?
Llandaff Cathedral has had two decades of disastrous Deans on the trot and having taken three years to get rid of Barry's golf caddie the dud Capon following the Aga saga, Caiaphas dumps yet another disaster on us.
DeleteAnd the new Lay Chapter under Gerard Elias just goes along with it.
The sooner the swamp swallows Llandaff, the better.
Mark Preece was overlooked and insulted, and look at the outcome. Another PR disaster in the Western Mail with more to come.
Such PR disaster as there might be is because malcontents in Llandaff choose to go to the press to pursue their grievances or vendettas. Rather than fan the flames of endless strife in the cathedral, people might think of holding their peace until the outcome of the CDM is known.
DeleteRB
@Lux Et Veritas
DeleteA lot of very pertinent questions.
However, how long has it been since anyone in Llandaff Cathedral, Diocese or the Cult in Wales got something right or did the right thing?
The institution is inept and corrupt from top to bottom.
Martin Shipton's latest articles serve only to prove that reality and reveal the continuing Church MO of closing ranks, making threats, issuing gagging clauses, disposing of complainants, making whistle blowers redundant, playing hunt the mole and the blame game.
Don't forget the empty promise of the new Lay Chapter of Llandaff Cathedral to be more open and transparent.
RB might do well to consider that perhaps the "malcontents" in Llandaff are sick to the back teeth of being treated like mushrooms by successive Bishops and Deans of Llandaff.
DeleteLet the hierarchy reap as they have sown.
It would be both poetic justice and mightily hilarious if Dick the Dean were to return from his holiday to find Gerard Elias KC had changed all the locks on the Cathedral doors.
Delete🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣
As described by RB above, the "malcontents" in Llandaff have very good reasons for resorting to the local press, having been repeatedly ignored or further mistreated by the church and Cathedral authorities.
DeletePreviously described as "subversives" they have learned the hard way that making verbal complaints, written complaints, adhering to internal complaints policies, procedures and processes gets one nowhere.
David Jones, David Lambert, John Pockett, Nick Mason & some 30 other signatories, the Llanishen 17, Vicky Burrows formerly of Radyr, the redundant Lay Clerks, the dozens who left Llandaff and now attend St. Martin's in Roath, the curate Ceirion Gilbert, the list goes on and on.
One can hardly blame the "malcontents" for resorting to Martin Shipton and the court of public opinion in such circumstances. Indeed, one feels they should be congratulated on taking on the prevalent mushroom culture and corruption. All power to their collective elbows.
@RB
DeleteRather than fan the flames of endless strife in the Cathedral, Caiaphas could have left the appointment of Dick the Dean until after the outcome of the CDM is known.
Alternatively, she could have appointed the requested family man or even left the post vacant for a couple of months so that her successor could be involved in the selection process for the new Dean of Llandaff.
Clearly, her vindictiveness and agenda won out over common sense and probity.
Thank Christ at least she's gone for good but her dreadful reputation and disastrous legacy will long outlive her.
It’s one thing to say that the former bishop ought to have left the appointment to her successor, perhaps after any CDM complaint had been determined. It’s quite another to behave in a manner seemingly designed to undermine the ministry of the new Dean, which is all too clearly the intention of some of those who have posted on this thread.
DeleteRB
@Lux Et Veritas
DeleteAnother question; did Dick the Dean declare at any time during the recruitment and selection process to the appropriate authorities that he was the subject of an on-going CDM tribunal and / or defamation / libel proceedings?
Failing to do so might constitute gross misconduct and fraudulent appointment bringing both the Cathedral and the Church in Wales potentially into disrepute.
Is Gerard Elias KC looking into these issues? Surely somebody should be.
Nothing done by any contributors to this blog has undermined his ministry.
DeleteDick the Dean has succeeded in that all by himself by applying for and accepting the post of Dean of Llandaff before the CDM process has concluded and until he has been cleared of the charges of any alleged misconduct.
To do otherwise was foolish and irresponsible, the last things that Llandaff needed.
As soon as the chocolate teapot in Bangor claims that everything was done "above board", you can safely assume the exact opposite is far more likely to be the truth.
DeleteHow would Randy Pandy know one way or the other?
The recruitment, appointment and installation processes were all completed before Caiaphas vacated Llys Esgobette and the chocolate teapot has gone on public record that (even as Archbishop) he has no authority to intervene or interfere with the running of another Diocese.
Militant lesbian Zoe King on the Electoral College, quelle surprise!
DeleteLittle wonder typhoid Mary got the job.
Wheels within wheels, agendas hidden within agendas and plots within plots.
Above board indeed.
The ears in the walls report Komor was one of the candidates under consideration.
DeleteIf true, how could he be a member of the Electoral College?
Surely that would create a conflict of interest and he should have recused himself from being involved in any part of the proceedings?
Does one get elected to the Electoral College?
DeleteIf so, by what means?
Returning to the goings-on at Christ Church, it is noteworthy that in November last year the Charity Commission issued an Official Warning to the college in regard to the £6.6 million it spent between Aug 2018 and Jan 2022 on the dispute with its former Dean. Noting that there was no fixed budget and £5.3m was approved retrospectively, the regulator said:
Delete"We consider that the actions of the trustees at Christ Church amount to mismanagement and/or misconduct, after they failed to manage the charity’s resources responsibly or ensure that the charity is accountable in the context of a costly dispute."
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/charity-regulator-issues-official-warning-to-christ-church-oxford
They also forced Christ Church to conduct an independent review, to be led by former Attorney General Dominic Grieve, and to implement all its recommendations.
https://www.chch.ox.ac.uk/news/house/christ-church-appoints-rt-hon-dominic-grieve-qc-lead-its-independent-governance-review
This amounts to a very public dressing down for an ancient institution that evidently assumed it could get away with spending vast sums on an employment case.
The college published its side of the Martyn Percy affair on 27th May '22:
https://www.chch.ox.ac.uk/news/house/christ-church-and-dr-martyn-percy
which was followed by a refutation from Percy's supporters here:
https://www.turbulentpriest.net/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/Refutations-461155.pdf
@1662
DeleteAre free glasses of Sherry in the Lady Chapel also provided after the 8am and 9am Parish Sunday services or is it only the 11am Cathedral crowd that enjoy the fringe benefits of Dick the Dean's largesse?
"mismanagement and/or misconduct", failure to "manage the charity's resources responsibly", failure to "ensure the charity is accountable"
DeleteSuch terms could easily be applied to the dodgy Llandaff Organ appeal and its missing accounts, the concealed Quinquennial reports and the Capon's Aga saga.
What a pity Dominic Grieve isn't investigating the Llandaff Chapter minutes and accounts too.
It's obvious Dick the Dean is one of the main maggots in the Christchurch can of worms criticised by the Charity Commissioners.
DeleteAfter the disastrous Capon era Llandaff needed a safe pair of hands to get it back on its feet, but Caiaphas dumped slippery Dick in the Deanery.
Was this the quid pro quo for Thaxted agreeing to take the Capon off her hands?
One wonders how slippery Dick the Sherry might respond if the drunks, tramps and homeless usually struggling to survive around the RB Penthouse in the city centre were to discover he's handing out free glasses of fortified wine 🍷 and show up in numbers to claim their share of the bounty? 🤔
Delete@Ex 9o'clocker
DeleteNot that I know of.
Perhaps someone has persuaded slippery Dick that all the real moolah is to be found with the 11o'clockers and those will be the gullible pew-sitters most likely to support fund raising for the new music foundation, especially now there's no Parish choir.
There's a quiz and curry night being advertised to raise money for the privileged poor little rich kids too, no doubt to subsidise their next choir "tour".
Can anyone comment on Mary Stallard's performance as Asst Bishop and Archdeacon of Bangor as I'd like to know how well or otherwise she exercised those roles?
ReplyDeleteWHAMAB
She's known in Bangor as the poison dwarf. What more do you need to know about Typhoid Mary?
DeleteI could WHAMAB but to do so would identify myself which wouldn't be sensible. However, in the incidents I am aware of it appears her management style was more to the appeasement of +Andrew than to the rural parish memberships she was supposed to be serving resulting in their vowing never to have dealings with her again. Rudyard Kipling 'Female of the species ...' comes to mind.
ReplyDeleteThat said, if you read her 'cv' there's some slight relief in knowing that she seldom stays in one place for long. On past track record there could soon be a 74th bishop of Llandaff by which time Sion-the-Pontiff will be elevated to full Dean and with eyes on purple ... which his capitulating and weak benefactor, ++Andrew will no doubt bestow on him by means fair or foul.
Wasn't the last bishop of Llandaff number 71 ?
DeleteFrom what point in history should one begin counting?
DeleteFor many, neither Juno nor Typhoid Mary could ever be counted as real Bishops in any case.
Odd isn't it that for the election of a Bishop even to the most minor 'see' there is a huge kerfuffle, ancient rites, Electoral Colleges, benches of bishops, unabashed shenanigans, locked cathedrals and secret votes aided by belligerent LGBTQ+ pressure groups and yet for the appointment of an Assistant Bishop (acting in Bangor as a de facto full bishop even representing the real Bishop at the Queen's 70th service of thanksgiving) it can simply slip through on the whim of a plonker without reference to anyone. Can anyone explain it?
ReplyDeletehttps://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/64373487
ReplyDeleteWorld Athletics caving in to the Trans agenda and cabal.
Shameful.
An Assistant Bishop's appointment must be sanctioned by a majority of the Bench (Chapter 5, part 3 (15)) of the Constitution). So it's not entirely the Abp's patronage. Whether that is a suitable check and balance remains to be seen.
ReplyDeleteWHAMAB
Would the spineless junior plankers risk going up against and risking the ire of the chief plonker in Wales?
DeleteSomehow I doubt it.
https://llandaff.churchinwales.org.uk/en/news-and-blog/electoral-college-update/
ReplyDeleteIf one enlarges and studies closely the photo shown under the heading "Diocesan Profile", it appears that the tall bloke in the background is busy quaffing a large glass of Sherry, no doubt courtesy of Dick the Dean.
Utterly unseemly in the Lady Chapel.
Why not in the Prebendal House at least, or doesn't the Capon's new £30k kitchen provide the right ambience?
After what goes on in the Llandaff Deanery, sherry in the Lady Chapel is in keeping. The bottom has dropped out of the CinW and the early demise of Dick the Dean can only be a blessing. Perhaps he could take a few more CinW heirarchs with him.
DeleteLW
Why not hold the Sherry shindigs in the Deanery so everyone can finally get a good look at the Capon's new Aga they all paid for?
DeleteOne wonders if slippery Dick has remembered to obtain the appropriate licence from the local Magistrate for selling alcohol?
DeleteOur lovely new Dean does not need a licence to sell alcohol when the Cathedral isn't charging anyone for it.
DeleteYou're all disgusting homophobic malcontents who have it in for anyone trying to improve matters.
Well that isn't quite right is it UntRuthy?
DeleteSelling alcohol every Sunday would require a Premises licence as well as a personal licence.
If the Sherry is being given away gratis then the Charity Commissioners will want to know how buying and giving away Sherry supports the charitable objectives of Llandaff Cathedral?
Especially as slippery Dick the Dean has seemingly been implicated in the inappropriate expenditure of £6.5+ million of Christchurch funds!
Perhaps Teilo the dog is wandering around selling raffle tickets 🎟 for £5 a strip which can then be exchanged for a Schooner of Sherry?
DeleteEither way, it seems slippery Dick might well be in the sh*t.
In more ways than obe.
🤣 🤣 🤣
Just like the Cult in Wales, the corruption is widespread.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-64400235
Three metropolitan Plod to face Court each week.
Actually Ruthy, as Zebedee who is expert in all matters to do with the excellence of the Police Service will tell you, if there is an expectation that those who consume alcohol in places other than for instance private houses donate (rather than buy) then it is deemed within the law to be sale. This was to stamp out illegal 'after-hours' lock-in drinking and sale of alcohol in unlicensed premises. Previous to that, the try-on which failed at court and thus set precident was to claim that patrons had not paid for their sherry, beer, spirits etc., but rather paid for the hire of their glasses as with 'corkage' in posh restaurants.
ReplyDeleteIt could, therefore, be argued that if the cathedral encourages or expects parishioners to 'donate' into the collection plate towards cathedral overhead 'costs' and the bottle(s) of cheap sherry are purchased from that - which would also be contributed to by HMRC tax-back against Charity donations - then the 'lovely' Tricky-Dickie is in breach. It would hardly be tested of course, but for the record - you're wrong. Enjoy your Burns Night whisky drinking. Just don't try it on in a Scottish Episcopalian vestry.
Old Bill
The reason the suggested breach of licensing laws would hardly be tested is that the suggestion is obviously absurd, as is the suggestion that the church’s provision of refreshments is a breach of charity law. As for earlier posts, if sherry were available after the parish Eucharist no doubt you’d complain that the Dean was encouraging drink at inappropriate hours. And it is entirely normal to provide refreshments within a church, provided it’s not in the sanctuary or during the service, so there’s nothing “unseemly” about doing so in the Lady Chapel. The malice being shown to the Dean on this thread, as shown by the abusive nicknames, the ridiculous complaints and the repeated innuendo, is disgraceful.
DeleteRB
But it isn't available after the 9am Parish Eucharist is it Dopey?
DeleteWhat safeguarding measures have been taken to prevent underage children from attending the free piss-up in the Lady Chapel?
DeleteWhat if Chorister parents are partaking with the expectation their chorister children join them there after the service?
Sounds like another can of worms to me!
Dick the slippery Dean is tainted by the ongoing proceedings in Christchurch.
DeleteTo coin a phrase, the fear is that he might be a "manipulative little turd" which Llandaff definitely doesn't need after having taken some three years to rid itself of his predecessor.
Any "malice" being shown to Dick the Dean on here seems insignificant to that he showed to Martin Percy when he allegedly had all the locks changed on the doors of Christchurch College to prevent Dr Percy returning to work.
Delete@RB
DeleteAre you being deliberately obtuse or are you just thick?
The real point at issue is that the 12:15/12:30 Eucharist in the Lady Chapel has been replaced by a Sunday Sherry piss up, allegedly a freebie for the great and good.
If only the free "refreshments" were being provided for the homeless of Cardiff or Ukrainian migrants disposesed of their homes.
Is slippery Dick going to introduce dining on Swan at high table next?
Absurd it might be 'RB' but that's the law and presumably you don't lean towards the one law for the riff-raff and one law for us the 'parchus' church-goers?! Stupid law too that other than in premises where food is being served and other conditions, children must be distanced from adults who are consuming alcohol (licensed premises). Again another law which never attracts attention: but it exists. Does this suggest that children of the Sunday School should be ushered away while their mums and dads and priests are slugging Blob Shop sherry? Of course not. But its a fine line and hardly 'educational' to impressionable youngsters. But like Bangor cathedral there are hardly any children in Llandaff either.
ReplyDeleteAbusive nicknames you whinge? Oh come off it 'RB'. What sort of a cotton-wool school did you attend. Obviously you have no experience of HM Forces and their jocular naming across all ranks. Grow up.
Old Bill
"Provision of refreshments" is no breach of charity law.
DeleteHowever, giving away free booze in the Lady Chapel may well be.
Please explain how such expenditure would be supporting the charitable objectives of Llandaff Cathedral?
I'm not bothered by the (technical) illegality of these drinking sessions, such objections so far expressed sounding rather quibbling. What appals me is that they should be taking place in what is supposed to be a place of prayer dedicated to the Mother of our Redeemer rather than in an appropriately secular space. Does Llandaff have no reverence for her who is More Honourable than the Cherubim, More Glorious than the Seraphim?
ReplyDeleteLlandaff has no reverence for anyone and hasn't done so for decades.
DeleteSome of us are very bothered by technical irregularities or illegalities, like failing to keep and publish accounts for the Organ appeal.
DeleteSuccessive Bishops and Deans have engaged in coverups and then label those of us who query such irregularities as subversives or malcontents.
The worms have turned.
To be fair, it’s horses for courses and I suspect the kind of person who attends the 11am would be quite partial to a small sherry before lunch. No issue with children- there aren’t many there.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I’m not entirely sure I think it sends the right message around alcohol, but that said it seems to be coming from a good intention to create a sense of belonging for quite a unique set of parishioners.
It’s so nice that the Dean clearly wants to spend time around parishioners and is creating opportunities for regular sociability. That can only be a good thing and is something I would expect cathedral congregations to welcome.
Cheers-My-Dears
Provision of alcohol in the Lady Chapel will cause more division than ' a sense of belonging', which is straight out of the Woke book. So much need in society and this is what the Church comes up with. Perhaps the Chapter can take Dick to one side and tell him before the image of the Cathedral is further damaged.
DeleteLW
As there was discussion umpteen months ago regarding the identity (or identities) of the demised plonker 'TP' I have to wonder if 'RB' and his blinkered comments in defence of everything which is indefensible is in fact acronym for 'Representative Body' in which case, hullo Anna Morrell.
ReplyDeleteNice try, Ad Clerum. And no dafter - and rather more charitable - than many of the posts on this thread. But I have no connection with either the Representative Body or Ms Morrell.
DeleteRB
Many doubt you have any connection to Christianity.
DeleteWhy would that be, Enoch?
DeleteBecause I say that the offering of Sherry (not a “piss-up” or a “drinking session”, as two contributors choose to mischaracterise it) after a service is no reason to attack the Dean, whether or not one thinks it a good idea?
Because I don’t accept the ill-informed assertions made by some contributors concerning licensing and charity law?
Because I don’t think that derogatory name-calling (even by those with the advantage of a background in the Services) is an example to be followed in church?
Or for some other reason?
RB
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-64420124
ReplyDeleteWill Black Lives Matter demand everyone "take the knee" over this case too?
In retirement I help out in a Benefice of six parishes two of which serve sherry following divine worship - a very convivial thing to do. I recall that sherry played a large role in the TV Sit Com "All Gas and Gaiters" which depicted the Church of England when it was the Church of England. On one occasion Archdeacon Henry Blunt was presented with a half full glass of sherry, on its reception he commented "I hadn't realised that it was still Lent, bishop!"
ReplyDelete"All Gas & Gaiters" was of course entirely fictitious, even if some of the characters and situations were exaggerated versions of their factual counterparts. The Llandaff crew might profitably watch this 50 year-old video of another cathedral, noting the deportment of the clergy (especially the Bishop, +Robert Mortimer), and the fact that during the service at the end (Matins -- what's that?) every single visible member of the congregation -- many of them probably not regular churchgoers -- is "meekly kneeling on [his or her] knees", a posture rarely seen nowadays. https://www.nfb.ca/film/exeter/?fbclid=IwAR0MK-KHrEuiy3ynuzz6lOXL5WPYVnvFFMZ6uiZhAB_9fswjVH99AQYbTz8
DeleteTell us Father, did Christ serve sherry all round after the last supper?
DeletePerhaps we should all be going to Church for a drink and conviviality and down the pub to find God?
DeleteCome to think of it, finding God and the Holy Ghost in the Butcher's Arms would be easier than wasting my time looking in Llandaff Cathedral!
There's always St Canna's Alehouse in Cardiff, started in 2017 by a Baptist minister with the backing of his denomination...
ReplyDeleteA Baptist barman?
DeleteBet the ale is watered down!
🤣
I don't like beer and I've never been to St Canna's. But I'd be very surprised if its ale wasn't the proper stuff!
Delete@Exodus - No, but they'd probably each drunk four cups of wine by then!
ReplyDeleteMaybe that's why they all nodded off instead of praying for their leader in the garden at Gethsemene?
DeleteThe flesh was instructed but the sprit was stronger. 😂
You might have a point there!
DeleteA parishioner told me that a former Vicarage in the parish which she and her husband own has a covenant binding that they cannot brew alcohol there.
ReplyDeleteYet one can drink and distribute fortified wine in the lady Chapel at a old foundation cathedral outside the eucharist?
One wonders if any covenants exist in the cathedral?
WHAMAB
Slippery Dick isn't brewing, fermenting or distilling, just serving.
DeleteI don't know about covenants but Peggy "the taxman will never know" Pilate based her coven there for many years.
Would it make any difference at all WHAMAB?
DeleteAs has been well documented on many previous AB threads, the overriding attitude of the Cult in Wales is "We continue as we please".
The covenant on our house prevents us brewing alcohol, opening a dance hall or a gambling den!
DeleteSell up immediately!
Delete🤣
I know he wasn't brewing, my point was the incongruity of enforcing covenants on alcohol of former vicarages with what went on at Llandaff Cathedral?
ReplyDeleteWHAMAB
There is no incongruity. Lots of properties, not just former vicarages, are subject to restrictive covenants designed to protect the amenity of neighbouring properties. These are commonly imposed when new estates are developed or where a part of land is sold off for development and the rest is retained. There is no likelihood at all that an ancient cathedral will be subject to any such covenant. Brewing or distilling would be subject to planning control.
DeleteRB
It's the treatment of alcohol in both cases that is at variance clearly. One liberal, one illiberal, in that there is incongruity, at least for me.
ReplyDeleteIf I owned a home with a covenant binding on it, I may have felt miffed on reading about alcohol being consumed and given away in a C-i-W cathedral.
WHAMAB
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/01/29/lent-easter-cancelled-university-drive-remove-christian-term/
ReplyDeleteThe Leftwing School of Economics takes "woke" up another notch.
It's just the latest example of right-on thinking and an extension of replacing BC and AD with the "Common Era" rubbish.
DeleteHardly surprising to note no Bishops daring to speak out against the LSE Church of Woke either.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64460767
ReplyDeleteAnti-semitic Vicar of Virginia Water banned for twelve years.
The lunatic fringe are no longer a fringe in the Church of England.
'The acting Bishop of Winchester, the Rt Reverend Debbie Sellin, said: "It is the Church of England's task to lead in the work of enabling mutual understanding and strong, peaceable inter-faith relationships for the common good of society, and its ministers must take very seriously their role in initiating positive relationships between communities, locally, at diocesan and regional level, as well as nationally and internationally."' Funny, I thought the C of E had a rather different task, as in Matthew 28.19-20.
DeleteExactly Matthew. Women's studies haver replaced theology.
DeleteListening to Mary Stallard being interviewed by Abdul-Azim Ahmed on the BBC's 'All Things Considered' she followed the same line as Debbie Sellin. Advance to position 09.30 on https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001hm7s.
Thanks AB, but I'm not sure I can face any more bishopessing activity just now. Watch the Canadian video I mentioned in my 27 January comment if you want to be reminded of how far things have fallen.
DeleteWho wants to listen to Typhoid Mary for God's sake?
DeleteIt will be bad enough having to put up with her rubbish after she's been installed at Llys Esgobette in Llandaff (assuming she lacks the wits to turn it down). Better to avoid her as much as possible.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-64488011
ReplyDeleteBiden in it up to his neck once more.
I think the Cult in Wales needs a letter from St. Paul.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the point?
DeleteEven if anyone would read it, nobody would take any notice.
There are none so deaf as those who aren't listening.
Asking a very holy Priest from Oop North what he thought about the appointment to Llandaff. I've honestly never heard this guy talk ill of anybody. His reply was, 'Well, she's got a bit of an edge to her' .
ReplyDelete